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jedi_of_urthSo I think we all know why I made a point of watching TVD the night it aired for once. Starts with E, ends with –lijah.
Now here’s a triangle I can deal with.
Because yeah, this episode seems carefully constructed to straddle to Elena/Elijah/Katherine triangle, such as it is. It seems to me that while Elijah probably does want to save Katherine, Elena still has the much bigger hold on him. I don’t really believe Katherine loves Elijah, but I could buy there’s an element of truth in it. And Elena...well Elena’s off the rails right now but as usual she and Elijah can actually TALK about what’s going on; even like this the two of them actually manage to communicate.
I’m going to have to rewatch the Elena/Elijah scenes repeatedly (wow, something in s4 I could stand to rewatch) because there’s a lot that can be read into those scenes. But here’s a run down of my thoughts I can recall.
-Elijah totally knew it was Elena before he kissed her, whether he was testing to see how far she’d go with her Kat impersonation or what, he totally knew.
-HAHAHAHA, Elijah threatening Elena to Stefan. Stefan’ll buy it, but I don’t for a second, not this time. Certainly not over Katherine sine I’m pretty sure he wants the cure for Elena’s sake (yes I considered he might want it as a precaution against Silas but... supposedly he and Kat were working together before Silas was awakened, so at most he wanted to control the cure and with that I suspect Elena reasons).
-I’m pretty sure new-Elena thinks Elijah is pathetic for “threatening” her when they’re really just standing around having a chat.
-I was slightly worried they were actually going for Elijah/Kat but then we got Elijah’s reaction to the news about Jeremy and yeah, that completely reads as him being horrified for Elena’s sake because hurting Elena is not on his list of allowable things.
-I’m about 90% sure that 90% of the Elena/Elijah conversation was not about Katherine beyond the superficial level but was about the two of them. Elena’s projecting herself onto Katherine (try and tell me the “the peasant girl you loved is gone” line isn’t equally about Kat and the old-Elena, just try), for that matter Elijah’s slightly muddling the two of them anyway, and Elijah’s keeping it in Katherine terms because he knows Elena won’t hear it if he really discusses how things stand with them or even just her.
-Elena kept the letter, up until the house burned down anyway. Remember how pissy Tyler got over Caroline keeping Klaus’s sketches? Well Elena kept Elijah’s love letter all this time.
-Oh show (possibly oh Elena, but I kind of think the show is to blame), it’s was “Carry [your compassion] with you, as I will carry my regret. Always and forever, Elijah.” Not “carry your compassion with you always and forever.” If Elena is choosing to misremember/misrepresent it in less love letter terms then, oh Elena; but my initial guess is the show trying to pull back from how love lettery it was.
(-However, they did at least bring it up, including that he used the always and forever bit (if wrongly placed) and have Elijah reference the family always and forever, in the same episode. Elena is part of his always and forever, and it’s like in some bits they remember that but not in others.)
Okay, so the Elijah/Kat stuff is really only interesting to me in how it relates to Elena/Elijah but broken down: I think they were both using each other and whatever feelings might be there, at its core it’s about two people not in the “relationship”, namely Elena and Klaus. Not only do I think Elijah wanted the cure for Elena and obviously Kat wanted it as a way to get away from Klaus for good; but I think Elijah’s love for Elena was what made him think he could and should “save” Katherine and I think on some level Kat knows he’s in love with Elena (she made sure to tell him Elena’s a vampire but not about killing Jeremy, and her attitude in their talk after the E/E scenes seemed like...she knew Elena could and would come between them, regardless of her bravado to the guys on the subject).
Rebekah, Elena, and Kat make a good group, can we have more scenes with those characters (and Elijah)?
Oh, the Salvatores were in this episode...okay.
“You don’t have a smart brother” may be the best line ever.
Oh Elijah. He may not have many demands for Klaus but I bet the ones he does have include leaving alone a pair of doppelgangers that he has confusing feelings about.
So...the last scene. Look, a dozen episodes ago (a season ago, three seasons ago...) when I WANTED Elena to tell the Salvatoers to stop trying to control her life I got nothing. Everything you want in the worst way I guess. If I thought the show was actually going to have a good story grow from this I would...not like it, but I could enjoy the good story anyway; but I have no confidence in that happening. Hey, isn’t that basically what I said about Elena becoming a vampire in the first place? And look at the mess they gave us from that; yeah not any more – in fact considerably less – confident in this going well that I was that.
Oh right, Caroline and Klaus had a whole bunch of scenes in this episode too, I still don’t care. But I find it really odd considering Klaus will be going off to TO after this season and this felt more like smoothing things over for a long game of ship tease to continue.
But mostly there were Elena/Elijah scenes that I may even rewatch, that’s what really matters here. (Plus, I may still have to try and write my now AU idea of him compelling her to turn her humanity back on, I’m not exactly surprised the show didn’t go there for both in character and meta reasons, but I thought it had potential. For that matter, what did Elijah do that was shocking and unlikable here?)
Now here’s a triangle I can deal with.
Because yeah, this episode seems carefully constructed to straddle to Elena/Elijah/Katherine triangle, such as it is. It seems to me that while Elijah probably does want to save Katherine, Elena still has the much bigger hold on him. I don’t really believe Katherine loves Elijah, but I could buy there’s an element of truth in it. And Elena...well Elena’s off the rails right now but as usual she and Elijah can actually TALK about what’s going on; even like this the two of them actually manage to communicate.
I’m going to have to rewatch the Elena/Elijah scenes repeatedly (wow, something in s4 I could stand to rewatch) because there’s a lot that can be read into those scenes. But here’s a run down of my thoughts I can recall.
-Elijah totally knew it was Elena before he kissed her, whether he was testing to see how far she’d go with her Kat impersonation or what, he totally knew.
-HAHAHAHA, Elijah threatening Elena to Stefan. Stefan’ll buy it, but I don’t for a second, not this time. Certainly not over Katherine sine I’m pretty sure he wants the cure for Elena’s sake (yes I considered he might want it as a precaution against Silas but... supposedly he and Kat were working together before Silas was awakened, so at most he wanted to control the cure and with that I suspect Elena reasons).
-I’m pretty sure new-Elena thinks Elijah is pathetic for “threatening” her when they’re really just standing around having a chat.
-I was slightly worried they were actually going for Elijah/Kat but then we got Elijah’s reaction to the news about Jeremy and yeah, that completely reads as him being horrified for Elena’s sake because hurting Elena is not on his list of allowable things.
-I’m about 90% sure that 90% of the Elena/Elijah conversation was not about Katherine beyond the superficial level but was about the two of them. Elena’s projecting herself onto Katherine (try and tell me the “the peasant girl you loved is gone” line isn’t equally about Kat and the old-Elena, just try), for that matter Elijah’s slightly muddling the two of them anyway, and Elijah’s keeping it in Katherine terms because he knows Elena won’t hear it if he really discusses how things stand with them or even just her.
-Elena kept the letter, up until the house burned down anyway. Remember how pissy Tyler got over Caroline keeping Klaus’s sketches? Well Elena kept Elijah’s love letter all this time.
-Oh show (possibly oh Elena, but I kind of think the show is to blame), it’s was “Carry [your compassion] with you, as I will carry my regret. Always and forever, Elijah.” Not “carry your compassion with you always and forever.” If Elena is choosing to misremember/misrepresent it in less love letter terms then, oh Elena; but my initial guess is the show trying to pull back from how love lettery it was.
(-However, they did at least bring it up, including that he used the always and forever bit (if wrongly placed) and have Elijah reference the family always and forever, in the same episode. Elena is part of his always and forever, and it’s like in some bits they remember that but not in others.)
Okay, so the Elijah/Kat stuff is really only interesting to me in how it relates to Elena/Elijah but broken down: I think they were both using each other and whatever feelings might be there, at its core it’s about two people not in the “relationship”, namely Elena and Klaus. Not only do I think Elijah wanted the cure for Elena and obviously Kat wanted it as a way to get away from Klaus for good; but I think Elijah’s love for Elena was what made him think he could and should “save” Katherine and I think on some level Kat knows he’s in love with Elena (she made sure to tell him Elena’s a vampire but not about killing Jeremy, and her attitude in their talk after the E/E scenes seemed like...she knew Elena could and would come between them, regardless of her bravado to the guys on the subject).
Rebekah, Elena, and Kat make a good group, can we have more scenes with those characters (and Elijah)?
Oh, the Salvatores were in this episode...okay.
“You don’t have a smart brother” may be the best line ever.
Oh Elijah. He may not have many demands for Klaus but I bet the ones he does have include leaving alone a pair of doppelgangers that he has confusing feelings about.
So...the last scene. Look, a dozen episodes ago (a season ago, three seasons ago...) when I WANTED Elena to tell the Salvatoers to stop trying to control her life I got nothing. Everything you want in the worst way I guess. If I thought the show was actually going to have a good story grow from this I would...not like it, but I could enjoy the good story anyway; but I have no confidence in that happening. Hey, isn’t that basically what I said about Elena becoming a vampire in the first place? And look at the mess they gave us from that; yeah not any more – in fact considerably less – confident in this going well that I was that.
Oh right, Caroline and Klaus had a whole bunch of scenes in this episode too, I still don’t care. But I find it really odd considering Klaus will be going off to TO after this season and this felt more like smoothing things over for a long game of ship tease to continue.
But mostly there were Elena/Elijah scenes that I may even rewatch, that’s what really matters here. (Plus, I may still have to try and write my now AU idea of him compelling her to turn her humanity back on, I’m not exactly surprised the show didn’t go there for both in character and meta reasons, but I thought it had potential. For that matter, what did Elijah do that was shocking and unlikable here?)
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I LIKE IT!
Date: 2013-03-29 08:12 pm (UTC)Re: I LIKE IT!
Date: 2013-03-29 09:12 pm (UTC)But seriously, audible sigh of relief when he was like "I know it's you Elena" when I wasn't sure he had known until then, and that allows me to go back to the kiss and think 'He probably at least suspected and he totally kissed her anyway'; and the rest of the episode was just Elena/Elijah subtext (and sometimes not very sub) everywhere. Elijah/Kat is an interesting emotional mess for both of them, but I think it definitely comes across as Elijah actually loves Elena.
As much as this episode felt crafted to work for both sides of this "triangle" the fact that it still comes across as a triangle is no small matter.
Re: I LIKE IT!
Date: 2013-03-29 11:39 pm (UTC)Re: I LIKE IT!
Date: 2013-03-29 11:54 pm (UTC)If Elijah getting Elena to turn her humanity back on didn't happen this week I'm not confidant he will next time, but I'm not adverse to it happening at all.
Re: I LIKE IT!
Date: 2013-03-30 01:12 am (UTC)Re: I LIKE IT!
Date: 2013-03-30 01:32 am (UTC)I am surprised we didn't get more of a reaction from Elijah to humanity-off Elena, but I kind of think that it happened because of dead Jeremy kind of stopped him from pushing her. Not completely since I do see him holding out hope for her and trying to draw her back, but its less than seems completely in character. I do at least expect him to keep expressing how he hopes she'll find her way back, if he drops it entirely it would be very OOC.
Re: I LIKE IT!
Date: 2013-03-30 02:45 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2013-03-29 11:35 pm (UTC)Interesting, I did wonder what Elijah's motive was. He promised Katherine that he would use it to bargain her freedom with Klaus, but I kept thinking that he must have had his own agenda too. I don't think he wanted it to give to Elena though.
I’m pretty sure new-Elena thinks Elijah is pathetic for “threatening” her when they’re really just standing around having a chat.
That was hilarious, I don't think either of them believed it for a second.
but I think Elijah’s love for Elena was what made him think he could and should “save” Katherine and I think on some level Kat knows he’s in love with Elena (she made sure to tell him Elena’s a vampire but not about killing Jeremy, and her attitude in their talk after the E/E scenes seemed like...she knew Elena could and would come between them, regardless of her bravado to the guys on the subject).
I completely agree on the second part; Katherine knew instantly that Elena was a threat and would be able to drive a wedge between them. I sort of wish that the first part was true, since it would be slightly more palatable than the whole Katerina thing. I wanted more of a sense that Elijah owes Katherine something, that he wants to make it up to her, but instead it was more about what he wanted from her.
“You don’t have a smart brother” may be the best line ever.
Best line of the episode for sure.
no subject
Date: 2013-03-30 12:26 am (UTC)Well, none of them (as far as we know) knew there was only one dose until they actually found it so I can certainly believe he wanted to have control over what happened with the hypothetical widely available cure. But I do think he wanted Elena to have the option, I don't think he'd force it on her but he probably assumed (not inaccurately) that Elena would want the cure; remember Elijah was of the opinion (also not inaccurately) that Elena viewed being a vampire as something she deeply did not want ("She'll never forgive you" comes to mind, plus the whole deal about letting her live out her human life when her being a vampire would have solved all their problems). He'd probably have respected it if, when he offered, she told him that she was fine with what had happened, but as is he's sort of between a rock and a hard place.
I don't think either of them believed it for a second.
I'm not entirely sure even Stefan believed him this time around but clearly Elena didn't; and Elijah was barely pretending, least of all to himself that he would hurt her.
I wanted more of a sense that Elijah owes Katherine something, that he wants to make it up to her, but instead it was more about what he wanted from her.
Exactly, which again makes it feel false when we know the way he acts with Elena when they're a lot more even in terms of who's hurt who. He never acts like he he accepts why Katherine did what she did, which was really their fault anyway and the fallout from it was hardly her fault; we know the way he acts hen he can forgive someone just about anything and he doesn't act like that with Katherine.
Which was why I went to place where it was started by Elena, because it really doesn't look like it was started by feelings for Katherine; loving Elena, all that he'll forgive her for, maybe he owed Katherine a second chance to prove herself to him (which again, isn't what it would be about if he really wanted her).
no subject
Date: 2013-03-30 12:34 am (UTC)He never acts like he he accepts why Katherine did what she did, which was really their fault anyway and the fallout from it was hardly her fault
Right, exactly. It's just... no. Huge blind spot there.
4x18
Date: 2013-04-06 02:08 am (UTC)I think both Nina and Daniel intentionally played up the intimacy between Elena/Elijah vs. Elijah/Kat. Unlike some other Elejah fans, I didn't really mind the Eli/Kat angle because it seemed so obvious that he was projecting his feelings for Elena onto Kat. On a fundamental level, Elijah would never like or respect someone like Kat. The brief, flashback glimpses we got of Kat implies that he was attracted to her Elena-like characteristics. She seemed kind and hopeful. As much as I like Katherine, I don't think Elijah could ever truly relate to her (and definitely not love the true her/Kat).
I always laugh when I read your reviews...so...thank you! Elijah's disdain for the Salvatores is one of my fav parts of the show. He's so clearly superior to both of them. Elena and Kat are also superior...I just wish Elena would read the memo.
I really loved the Elena/Rebekah bits as well. My inner fangrrrl really wants Elena to glom onto Rebekah like a surrogate sister. It just breaks my heart that Elena has no one left (family wise). The Originals need to adopt her.
Re: 4x18
Date: 2013-04-06 08:18 pm (UTC)I wasn't nervous exactly, but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little anxious to see what would happen. And ultimately, like you I thought it did better than I expected; my expectations were pretty low though.
I think both Nina and Daniel intentionally played up the intimacy between Elena/Elijah vs. Elijah/Kat.
Totally agreed. While Elijah/Kat scenes may allow for more...obvious intimacy, to me it was clear they were playing the real emotional intimacy as between Elena and Elijah. They're written that way to even though these days I hate giving credit to the writers. The Elena/Elijah scenes are written with heart and yearning and emotion beneath the surface of character who for one reason or another can't display much or any of it (that ND and DG perform beautifully); while the Elijah/Kat scenes are written as a shadow of something that maybe once could have been (and now is mainly about projection, I also very much agree with that).
The Originals need to adopt her.
I want Nina to go off to TO so badly, as much as I like Katherine schooling the Salvatores from time to time I still think all her characters have so much more potential with the Originals (and we'd probably get to meet Tatia); and if they were regulars on the same show we'd probably get some actual Elejah. That's what dreams and fanfic are for I guess.