Waters of Mars thoughts
Nov. 17th, 2009 12:45 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
jedi_of_urthSo yeah, I finally watched Waters of Mars...
General gasping
Whoa...just...whoa.
The first two thirds or so or that was already kind of depressing, if not unexpected that the Doctor would find himself in *another* hopeless situation but then...
At first I couldn’t tell what the story expected us to feel, I believe me exact words were ‘I’m not sure if I’m supposed to be cheering or horrified, but I’m pretty much horrified.’ I mean, RTD has had a history of letting the Doctor be a law unto himself so I couldn’t be *sure* it went to be scaring the shit out of me, but now I can be pretty confident it was. “The laws of time will obey ME,” pretty much trampled over Family of Blood as the darkest moment for the Doctor, and it doesn’t look like it’s over yet.
I *think* this time, unlike in season 3, RTD is planning to actually pay off this build up effectively (which I’ll have more thoughts on when I talk about the promo). Partly I just figure that because he himself brought it to this point this time, whereas in season 3, having not written some of the really dark steps he might not have been as in tune with what how it came off. Also, since he now probably *does* realize it he’s probably even more inclined to make the pay off. And then partly, as much as a part of me would (almost) laugh at him leaving this hanging like a lead balloon over Moffat’s reign, I really don’t think he’d set something like this up with so little time left if he didn’t plan to use the story.
Side note, I have no problem with the absence of the reapers here. The Doctor wasn’t there twice, he probably also gets a power boost to stopping that kind of thing when he calls the full might of being the Lord of Time down on himself. What I was wondering was what had happened to the people we still know on Earth during all the events Adelaide listed off which had no bearing on the rest of the episode.
I’m glad Adelaide recognized that this was.not.right. Not that it was great for him to roll over and accept that he couldn’t do anything for the crew, but fighting against the rules of Time is different that declaring yourself the God of All Time. Or, dare I say it, the Master of Time. Thing is I *hate* the idea that anything is so predestined that it can’t be altered, just like I hate that the Dalek didn’t kill kid-Adelaide just “because.” I mean if they had succeeded in destroying the world, it wouldn’t have happened, therefore by that logic if you know there’s a fixed point death that won’t happen if you destroy Earth and therefore her 50 years earlier you’d be left to conclude that said attempt to destroy Earth wasn’t going to be successful.
Doctor/Rose related
And really Ten I, you sent Rose off with Ten II because *he* was supposed to be the dangerous one?
Actually I’m thinking this is where the problem comes from, in JE he was split in two, the man (not necessarily human, but the man) and the Time Lord, between the short time frame and that Ten I spent JE hanging around Rose it didn’t look that way at first. But ultimately that’s how it ended up and all that’s left for Ten I to be is The Time Lord, everything else he ever could have been, went (or you know, Ten I GAVE) to Ten II.
Another thing I distinctly remember saying in the episode:
Doctor: You didn’t shoot that guy. I loved you for that.
Me: You JACKASS.
If for some reason you can’t figure out why, remember this is in the Doctor/Rose section of the reaction post.
It does sort of go to support the idea that he only didn’t say it in JE because he was so invested in playing matchmaker, because he had made the decision as to how it would go. Or maybe he knew that what was left in Time Lord Doctor wasn’t enough, too much of the man Rose loved was in Ten II. If she could only save one of them from the darkness it might as well be Ten II. Of course it’s circular logic in that he made sure it happened that way by sending them off together and cutting himself off from the chance to have that life, but I have no problem thinking he’d come to that conclusion.
This whole thing has been another round of ‘why the Doctor needs a companion’ because I can’t see this going so far with anyone around him, but there’s a difference between stopping before tumbling into the abyss (which he hesitated at here and then decided to jump anyway where before he’d always had reason to stop) and turning away from it
Considering the fact that he’s wearing the same space suit when he declares himself Lord of Time as he was when he famously told the devil “I believe in HER” I think there might be something there. I’m not great with symbolism that I didn’t think of it until I started writing this paragraph, but it’s there. And of course to me it’s a reminder of how much it is losing (repeatedly) Rose that has changed him between those episodes.
Thoughts including the promo (and some more shipping babble):
I think it’s no coincidence that we’re going down this road again and using the Master at the end. Although, from what little I know it really *ought* to be the Valeyard this time (really should have been last time too), and it could just be the Valeyard claiming to be the Master from what we saw...maybe. I wouldn’t rule it out at least.
As great as it will be to see Donna again, and we do need to address her story again before Ten I regenerates, I don’t see that as enough at this point. Donna is the voice that makes the Doctor stop sure; she can, when he’s at his lowest, get him through it and when he’s not they’re friends. But what he needs is Rose, Rose is the one who makes him want to *be* better
Of course I said that in season 3 too, I’m still not sure I was wrong.
General gasping
Whoa...just...whoa.
The first two thirds or so or that was already kind of depressing, if not unexpected that the Doctor would find himself in *another* hopeless situation but then...
At first I couldn’t tell what the story expected us to feel, I believe me exact words were ‘I’m not sure if I’m supposed to be cheering or horrified, but I’m pretty much horrified.’ I mean, RTD has had a history of letting the Doctor be a law unto himself so I couldn’t be *sure* it went to be scaring the shit out of me, but now I can be pretty confident it was. “The laws of time will obey ME,” pretty much trampled over Family of Blood as the darkest moment for the Doctor, and it doesn’t look like it’s over yet.
I *think* this time, unlike in season 3, RTD is planning to actually pay off this build up effectively (which I’ll have more thoughts on when I talk about the promo). Partly I just figure that because he himself brought it to this point this time, whereas in season 3, having not written some of the really dark steps he might not have been as in tune with what how it came off. Also, since he now probably *does* realize it he’s probably even more inclined to make the pay off. And then partly, as much as a part of me would (almost) laugh at him leaving this hanging like a lead balloon over Moffat’s reign, I really don’t think he’d set something like this up with so little time left if he didn’t plan to use the story.
Side note, I have no problem with the absence of the reapers here. The Doctor wasn’t there twice, he probably also gets a power boost to stopping that kind of thing when he calls the full might of being the Lord of Time down on himself. What I was wondering was what had happened to the people we still know on Earth during all the events Adelaide listed off which had no bearing on the rest of the episode.
I’m glad Adelaide recognized that this was.not.right. Not that it was great for him to roll over and accept that he couldn’t do anything for the crew, but fighting against the rules of Time is different that declaring yourself the God of All Time. Or, dare I say it, the Master of Time. Thing is I *hate* the idea that anything is so predestined that it can’t be altered, just like I hate that the Dalek didn’t kill kid-Adelaide just “because.” I mean if they had succeeded in destroying the world, it wouldn’t have happened, therefore by that logic if you know there’s a fixed point death that won’t happen if you destroy Earth and therefore her 50 years earlier you’d be left to conclude that said attempt to destroy Earth wasn’t going to be successful.
Doctor/Rose related
And really Ten I, you sent Rose off with Ten II because *he* was supposed to be the dangerous one?
Actually I’m thinking this is where the problem comes from, in JE he was split in two, the man (not necessarily human, but the man) and the Time Lord, between the short time frame and that Ten I spent JE hanging around Rose it didn’t look that way at first. But ultimately that’s how it ended up and all that’s left for Ten I to be is The Time Lord, everything else he ever could have been, went (or you know, Ten I GAVE) to Ten II.
Another thing I distinctly remember saying in the episode:
Doctor: You didn’t shoot that guy. I loved you for that.
Me: You JACKASS.
If for some reason you can’t figure out why, remember this is in the Doctor/Rose section of the reaction post.
It does sort of go to support the idea that he only didn’t say it in JE because he was so invested in playing matchmaker, because he had made the decision as to how it would go. Or maybe he knew that what was left in Time Lord Doctor wasn’t enough, too much of the man Rose loved was in Ten II. If she could only save one of them from the darkness it might as well be Ten II. Of course it’s circular logic in that he made sure it happened that way by sending them off together and cutting himself off from the chance to have that life, but I have no problem thinking he’d come to that conclusion.
This whole thing has been another round of ‘why the Doctor needs a companion’ because I can’t see this going so far with anyone around him, but there’s a difference between stopping before tumbling into the abyss (which he hesitated at here and then decided to jump anyway where before he’d always had reason to stop) and turning away from it
Considering the fact that he’s wearing the same space suit when he declares himself Lord of Time as he was when he famously told the devil “I believe in HER” I think there might be something there. I’m not great with symbolism that I didn’t think of it until I started writing this paragraph, but it’s there. And of course to me it’s a reminder of how much it is losing (repeatedly) Rose that has changed him between those episodes.
Thoughts including the promo (and some more shipping babble):
I think it’s no coincidence that we’re going down this road again and using the Master at the end. Although, from what little I know it really *ought* to be the Valeyard this time (really should have been last time too), and it could just be the Valeyard claiming to be the Master from what we saw...maybe. I wouldn’t rule it out at least.
As great as it will be to see Donna again, and we do need to address her story again before Ten I regenerates, I don’t see that as enough at this point. Donna is the voice that makes the Doctor stop sure; she can, when he’s at his lowest, get him through it and when he’s not they’re friends. But what he needs is Rose, Rose is the one who makes him want to *be* better
Of course I said that in season 3 too, I’m still not sure I was wrong.
no subject
Date: 2009-11-21 02:56 am (UTC)I'm sure the focus will be on the Doctor given what we've been seeing, but that doesn't mean we won't see plenty of Donna.